One Wisconsin Institute
Press Release

Donald Trump Poised to Make U.S. Supreme Court Nomination Despite Unresolved Questions of Possible Constitutional Violations and Russian Election Interference

American People Deserve Answers Before Trump Makes Pick That Could Leave Mark on High Court for Decades

By - Jan 27th, 2017 01:46 pm
Donald Trump. Photo from whitehouse.gov.

Donald Trump. Photo from whitehouse.gov.

MADISON, Wis. — Donald Trump has announced, via Twitter, he intends to reveal his nominee to fill a vacancy on the United States Supreme Court next Thursday. Trump’s pronouncement comes amid serious scrutiny by the U.S. Senate over Russian interference in the presidential election and questions and legal action over the possibility that, through his business interests, he is in violation of the U.S. Constitution’s provisions banning a sitting president from receiving money from foreign governments.

“It is an outrageous affront to democracy that Donald Trump, with the legitimacy of his administration and his possible violation of the Constitution under such serious questions, would presume to make a lifetime appointment to fill a court vacancy,” commented One Wisconsin Institute Research Director Jenni Dye. “If Trump won’t respect our democracy, our elected officials in the U.S. Senate need to do their jobs and stand up to him and to stand up for our Constitution.”

The continuing vacancy on the nation’s high court is a result of the death of Antonin Scalia nearly one year ago. Senate Republicans refused to do their duty under the Constitution and did not give a hearing or vote on the nomination submitted by President Barack Obama weeks after Scalia’s passing, with nearly a full year left in his term.

The U.S. Senate Intelligence Committee has announced that it will conduct an inquiry into possible Russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election with the intent of helping elect Donald Trump. Intelligence agencies have publicly released information that shows Russians hacked into the emails of the national Democratic Party and Hillary Clinton campaign staff and directed the release of damaging information with the intent of influencing the outcome of the election.

Trump is also the subject of litigation alleging he has run afoul of provisions of the U.S. Constitution. A lawsuit has been filed in federal court claiming he is potentially receiving money from foreign governments through his business interests. If true, Trump would be in violation of the emoluments clause that prohibits such transactions. Despite this cloud over him, he has failed to fully separate himself from his and his family’s business interests and refuses to release his tax returns to determine if he has financial ties to foreign governments.

Dye concluded, “No one in history has faced such serious questions about their presidency. Before we allow Donald Trump to leave his mark on the Supreme Court for decades, we have to know whether a foreign government put him in office and whether Trump is using his presidency to increase his personal fortune. The American people deserve answers.”

One Wisconsin Institute is a non-partisan, progressive research and education organization dedicated to a Wisconsin with equal economic opportunity for all.

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64 thoughts on “Donald Trump Poised to Make U.S. Supreme Court Nomination Despite Unresolved Questions of Possible Constitutional Violations and Russian Election Interference”

  1. happyjack27 says:

    Still waiting on that confirmation hearing of Merrick Garland…

    Did a second vacancy already open up?

    Should definitely expedite that confirmation hearing of Merrick Garland, then.

  2. Steve G says:

    I think Y’all should just get over it!
    The people have spoken and they sure as hell weren’t speaking Russian!
    ‘non-partisan progressive organization’ my keister!

    For the record, I grew up in MKE but got to Texas over 30 years ago as quick as I could.

  3. Vincent Hanna says:

    People like you sure didn’t take that attitude when Obama was in office Steve. You brag about Texas like that will impress anyone here. Considering who leads your state, it doesn’t. Are you going to help build the wall? Make America Racist Again!

  4. Jake formerly of the LP says:

    Why would I accept someone who 54% of voters rejected, Steve from Texass? Especially when he’s violating the Constitution and apparently NOT EVEN LOOKING AT THE EXEC ORDERS HE IS SIGNING.

    https://twitter.com/JohnJHarwood/status/825438061416833025

    You caused this, we didn’t. And your dumb Tex-ass will probably be the one that loses a lot more than people like me will. Which apparently needs to happen for your soulless self not to see the danger in allowing this illegitimate president to seat a SCOTUS justice- especially after the majority-elected Obama wasn’t allowed to have his Justice voted on or even publically questioned.

  5. Jason says:

    I am sick of reading about Diane Sykes as a potential replacement for Antonin Scalia. Her husband Charlie is a never Trumper. He left WTMJ for MSNBC and all he does on there is “Never Trump”. Big Corporate Media let it go.

  6. Vincent Hanna says:

    Jason her name isn’t on the shortlist I read. The shortlist is three white males (of course).

    Based on his first week the entire world should be Never Trump.

  7. Jason says:

    Here Are The 4 Candidates On Trump’s Shortlist For The Supreme Court Nomination, Forbes January 27, 2017.

  8. Vincent Hanna says:

    Nah it’s down to three federal appeals court judges: Neil Gorsuch of Colorado, William Pryor of Alabama and Thomas Hardiman of Pennsylvania.

  9. Jason says:

    Trump is an odd duck. Your probably right, if he takes advice from his inner circle maybe they would suggest a women with strong credentials. Maybe, it would shut up Charlie and his small tent of never Trumpers.

  10. Steve G says:

    Vincent:
    I wasn’t bragging about Texas (although I proudly would if needed).

    Greg Abbott is a fine governor as is Walker for Wisconsin.

    Not sure what you mean about me helping build the wall.
    Totally out of context with SCOTUS nominee discussion.

  11. Steve G says:

    Jake:
    “Why would I accept someone who 54% of voters rejected?”
    Oh! I thought you all voted for Hillary.
    If you’re honest with yourself, Trump won in large part because Hillary was the one rejected

    Read up on the US Constitution. We are a Representative Republic, not a simple democracy.

    ‘All true republics (there are many pretenders) are democracies, but not all democracies are a republic. In a democracy, the will of the majority prevails. In a republic too, that happens, but the rights of minorities are equally protected. The majority cannot trample upon the basic and fundamental rights of a minority, even if that minority is just one person.’

    http://brilliantmaps.com/2016-county-election-map/

    You link a tweet fromn John Harwood? Ha-Ha-Ha!
    Fake News.

    From your post…”You caused this, we didn’t. And your dumb Tex-ass will probably be the one that loses a lot more than people like me will. Which apparently needs to happen for your soulless self not to see the danger in allowing this illegitimate president to seat a SCOTUS justice- especially after the majority-elected Obama wasn’t allowed to have his Justice voted on or even publically questioned.”

    Your ignorance revealing insult aside; I have a lot more confidence I will benefit more from this president than I would have with ‘Crooked Hillary’. And I truly believe that, ‘souless’ or not.

    As for SCOTUS nominees. Didn’t Obama succesfully appoint 2 already? FDR tried to pack the court and failed. Glad Obama did too.

  12. Steve G says:

    Vincent:
    You stated: “Based on his first week the entire world should be Never Trump.”

    Why? Because he’s keeping his promises to us ‘deplorables?’

    It’s about time a politician does that.

  13. Vincent Hanna says:

    Fake News? Abbott and Walker are fine governors (Walker’s approval rating begs to differ)?

    He sure isn’t draining the swamp Steve. One of the wealthiest and most connected cabinets ever assembled. And the refugee ban is deplorable and un-American, not to mention he conveniently didn’t include the Middle Eastern countries he happens to do business with. He’s a degenerate unfit for office. Enjoy Texas, which has the worst school standards in the nation. http://www.dallasnews.com/news/education/2016/01/27/report-says-texas-school-standards-are-worst-in-nation

  14. Steve G says:

    OK Vincent.
    “One of the wealthiest and most connected cabinets ever assembled.”
    Meaning what? Once you can demonstrate that any corruption results, then make your case. Until then, I suggest you dwell on the real corruption that had and would have continued to happen under a Hillary administration. Her claim that she had a private server for ‘convenience’ is laughable. Interesting that they’ve now shut down their foundation which was arguably nothing more than a slush fund to enrich themselves personally and provide access to ‘Her Highness’. In other words, Pay to Play.

    “And the refugee ban is deplorable and un-American, not to mention he conveniently didn’t include the Middle Eastern countries he happens to do business with.”
    Not sure that protecting our citizens is ;deplorable’ I think it’s admirable.
    Facts matter. As millions of people became refugees during World War II, US President Franklin D Roosevelt argued that refugees posed a serious threat to the country’s national security. Drawing on fears that Nazi spies could be hiding among them, the country limited the number of German Jews who could be admitted to 26,000 annually. And it is estimated that for most of the Hitler era, less than 25 percent of that quota was actually filled.

    In one of the most notorious cases, the US turned away the St Louis ocean liner, which was carrying 937 passengers, almost all of whom are thought to have been Jewish, in June 1939. The ship was forced to return to Europe, where more than a quarter of its passengers are thought to have been killed in the Holocaust.

    Following the 1979 Iranian hostage crisis, during which the US embassy in Tehran was stormed and 52 Americans were held hostage for 444 days, American President Jimmy Carter cut diplomatic relations with and imposed sanctions on Iran. He also banned Iranians from entering the country.

    Obama: “The State Department stopped processing Iraq refugees for six months in 2011, – even for many who had heroically helped U.S. forces as interpreters and intelligence assets. ”As a result, an “Iraqi who had aided American troops was assassinated before his refugee application could be processed, because of the immigration delays.” (One of the first men detained under Trump’s executive order, Hameed Darweesh, was an Iraqi interpreter for the U.S. military. He has now been released under an exemption in the order.)

    “He’s a degenerate unfit for office.” Oh like Bill Clinton was proven to be?

    “Enjoy Texas, which has the worst school standards in the nation.” Not sure what that has to do with our conversation, but I think it is fair to say that ‘school standards’ have less to do with success in school than parental involvement and commitment. Both of our kids went to public schools here and are college graduates (which were paid for out of our pockets). Both have terrific careers in their chosen professions (Civil Engineering and Business Management).
    To wit; from the article you provided:
    A new national study says Texas has the lowest education standards in the nation — giving the state a D+.
    But the study doesn’t directly say anything about how much Texas students are actually learning compared with students in other states. In fact, by some measures, Texas kids are doing pretty well.
    The report released Wednesday by educationnext.org demonstrates how hard it is to clearly compare state education systems. Another national study released a couple of years ago — and using some of the same kind of information — ranked Texas at the top.

  15. Vincent Hanna says:

    Dwell on a corruption in a Clinton administration that doesn’t exist rather than dwell on Trump actually refilling the swamp he pledged to drain with billionaires and donors? That makes no sense at all. What’s laughable is your claim that facts matter. The Clinton Foundation has a perfect Charity Navigator rating. The Trump Foundation? A moderate concern advisory for reasons made perfectly clear by David Fahrenthold. I’m sure he’s fake news too as anything you don’t like gets dismissed as fake news and then you don’t have to worry about pesky things like facts and truth and reality.

    Why is Trump exempting countries he does business with from the refugee ban?

    Enjoy Texas, ranked as one of the most dangerous states in the country. http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/article/Report-Texas-one-of-the-most-dangerous-states-5561680.php

  16. Steve G says:

    As for Walker’s approval rating, again I thnk results matter more than popularity polls, which sometimes more ‘fake news’ than one might be willing to admit.
    For all intents and purposes, he was elected 3 times in 4 years: 1st in 2010, again during the recall in 2012 and then for another term in 2014.
    By disparaging Walker like you did, you’re in effect disparaging your fellow state citizens.

    Like I said in my first post here, Y’all just need to get over it. the people have spoken.

    Personally I think your fellow Wisconsinites are looking forward to what Trump can do for them, particularly on the jobs front.
    I have some perspective on that issue.
    I grew up quite poor in a blue collar family in Milwaukee (Riverwest). My dad was a tannery worker (Trostel). My mom never worked outside the home but took care of 6 kids.
    I remember the great industries in MKE: A.O.Smith, Globe Union (I worked there myself for a time), American Motors, Harnishfeger, Allis Chalmers, Bucyrus Erie, and more I’m sure. Most are gone now or acquired with much smaller operations in the city.

    One of my favorite sayings is:
    Unless we change our direction, we’re going to end up where we’re headed!
    I’m happy to see that Wisconsin changed their direction starting back in 2010 and look to continue given their decision on November 8th.
    I have hundreds of relatives still back home and am hopeful that the situation there continues to improve.

  17. Vincent Hanna says:

    Trump can’t stop globalization and automation. People who deluded themselves into thinking he is going to bring jobs flooding back to small towns across the country are about to face a reality check, and they are not going to like it. The refugee ban nonsense isn’t bringing jobs back.

  18. Vincent Hanna says:

    Continues to improve? The worst in the Midwest economic growth since Walker took office? We aren’t even in the top half when it comes to states and economic growth and haven’t been in the Walker era. You have your facts about the state wrong. Maybe you should be posting on Urban Austin instead.

  19. Steve G says:

    “The Clinton Foundation has a perfect Charity Navigator rating”

    Donna Shalala is the CEO of Charity Navigator.

  20. Vincent Hanna says:

    It also has an A from Charity Watch. Trump meanwhile used funds from his charity to buy a Tim Tebow helmet.

  21. Steve G says:

    Post on Urban Austin? Ha!
    Austin is Madison with Justin boots instead of Birkenstocks.

    Besides, I live in DFW, Home of America’s team which traded wins with the Pack this year. 🙂
    Their playoff game was the best of all of this season’s. Could have gone either way.

  22. happyjack27 says:

    a) why would a misogynist appoint a woman?
    b) why would his inner circle, who are also misogynist, even suggest appoint a woman?
    c) like who, sarah palin? betsy devos? Kellyanne Conway? way to make your team even more of an embarrassment.
    d) why do you care the gender? what we’re looking for here is qualifications. though with the appointments we’ve seen so far i think we’d all settle for competency.

  23. happyjack27 says:

    “Like I said in my first post here, Y’all just need to get over it. the people have spoken.”

    …to which it was promptly pointed out that the majority of voters voted AGAINST Trump.

    I guess you missed that point about your premise being wrong.

  24. happyjack27 says:

    “By disparaging Walker like you did, you’re in effect disparaging your fellow state citizens.”

    I’m sure you said the same thing about Obama

    By telling the truth about politicians, we’re in effect helping to inform our fellow citizens, so they can make better decisions at the polls, thus leading to better quality of living.

    You’re welcome.

    Man, free speech much?

  25. Steve G says:

    Agree that truth matters.
    Of course the MSM push little more than fake news, so one needs to take all of that with a grain of salt.

  26. happyjack27 says:

    It’s a massive worldwide conspiracy, Steve G. All of media and all of the scientists and all of the teachers are teaming up to feed the rest of us lies.

    Fox News and Donald Trump are the only truly reliable sources of information.

  27. Vincent Hanna says:

    How are you defining fake news Steve (which is really a misnomer as if something is fake it can’t be news). Are you saying the MSM is guilty of doing the same thing as the people who wrote false stories about the Pope endorsing Trump or Clinton running a child sex ring out of a pizza shop? It’s hard to not see your statement as just a way for you to bypass critical thinking while you label anything you don’t like or agree with as “fake.”

  28. happyjack27 says:

    I can’t speak for Steve, but from my experience, like almost the same day those fake stories were reported, conservatives made their own definition of the same term (“fake news”), except their definition has nothing to do with “fake” or “real” — when a conservative says it, they mean “new information that is probably true but runs contrary to my ideology”.

    Again, only speaking from my personal experience here, but every time I’ve heard a conservative utter that phrase, that was how they were using the word.

    On a broader scale, it seems there are two parallel and yet very distinct vocabularies. Like two languages that share the same words but the words mean entirely different things. Very confusing.

  29. Vincent Hanna says:

    That is my understanding as well happyjack.

  30. Vincent Hanna says:

    And of course his “evidence” comes from the online gathering place of white supremacists and anti-Semites. Oh Steve. That’s very sad.

  31. AG says:

    For the first time, I can pretty clearly see a path to the end of the republic. Between the GOP refusing to have a hearing for almost a year for the appointment of a SCOTUS appointment and the Democrats/Reid using the nuclear option to fill the lower courts with partisan appointments, we have some serious issues coming our way. I can see this combining at the SCOTUS level so that eventually we won’t see any appointments unless one party has a super majority in both houses and have the White House.

    This is messing with one of the fundamental checks and balances and without the courts to keep the other branches in check, we’re sure to have some sort of conflict down the road. Worst case, we could potentially see military/armed conflict or states deciding to take matters more in their own hands then they are even now… including even succession.

  32. happyjack27 says:

    The bigger issue is that it’s not Trump’s vacancy to fill – it’s Barack Obama’s. And Barack nominated Merrick Garland.

    Congress has yet to pencil in a confirmation hearing for the Supreme Court nomination.

    If any vacancies come up under Trump’s … oh i can’t say that word here … , they would need to hold the confirmation hearing for Merrick Garland Before whoever trump appoints to that second vacancy.

    Unfortunately, Obama’s term has already run out, so if the Garland confirmation hearing result is in the negative (though I fail to see how that could happen – he is pretty neutral), well there’s no precedent for what to do, seeing as Obama can no longer nominate an alternative.

  33. Steve G says:

    Vincent: You said regarding my links to articles on Breitbart about fake news….: “his “evidence” comes from the online gathering place of white supremacists and anti-Semites.”

    Your statement/opinion was obviously derived from Fake News that was spread about Breitbart. All part of the ‘alt-right’ meme that floating around just prior to the election.

    Frankly, I suspect you don’t have a clue about Breitbart the site, their editorial slant or the man that founded it.
    Especially with respect to their coverage of all things Israel.

    http://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem

  34. AG says:

    happyjack27, even if what you say is true, and they HAVE to schedule a hearing, they can just deny him and move on to Trumps appointee.

  35. Vincent Hanna says:

    Shit that is bleak AG. I wish I disagreed with you.

    Bannon called Breitbart a platform for the alt-right. That is a fact. And the group’s main focus is “white identity” and to preserve “western civilization.” http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/11/22/alt-right-trump-white-nationalist-clinton-breitbart-spencer/94273282/

  36. Vincent Hanna says:

    Steve: “Trump Advisor Stephen Miller, The Architect Of The Muslim Ban, Has Ties To White Supremacists And Neo-Nazis.”
    White supremacist Richard Spencer calls himself Miller’s “mentor.”

    http://uproxx.com/news/stephen-miller-trump-adviser-neo-nazi-ties/

    There are white supremacists in the White House in 2017. I can’t fathom how someone with half-a-brain doesn’t find that terrifying.

  37. AG says:

    Oh yeah, I kinda got all dystopian there, didn’t I?

  38. Vincent Hanna says:

    I think it’s warranted. These are scary times.

  39. happyjack27 says:

    “happyjack27, even if what you say is true, and they HAVE to schedule a hearing, they can just deny him and move on to Trumps appointee.”

    Yeah, but they’d look totally asinine doing it – it’d be clear that it was juvenile and politically motivated. Not that that isn’t already blaringly obvious.

    But at the very least not having a hearing is “passively” juvenile and politically motivated. They could say it’s practically equivalent to the actions of a dead person. Except for that person would have to be dead only in certain circumstances, and then magically revived when a Republican president is in office.

  40. Steve G says:

    I forgot to suggest that you open your mind a little and look at all ‘news’ with an objective, critical eye.
    Most everyone has an agenda, but the media (including Breitbart) has that along with a big soapbox.
    And they leverage that position to shape public opinion to their point of view.

    Please realize that as fact.

    The media, especially the traditional mainstream is not working in your best interests, but theirs.
    And frankly they’ve been failing at that most recently.

  41. Steve G says:

    happyjack says…”It’s a massive worldwide conspiracy, Steve G. All of media and all of the scientists and all of the teachers are teaming up to feed the rest of us lies.

    Fox News and Donald Trump are the only truly reliable sources of information.”

    I never said that, but do believe that the progressive left has, for at least the last 60 years, taken a ‘long march’ approach to realizing a utopian vision nanny state where they decide what’s best for you whether you like it or not.

    Being from Milwaukee, you ought to recognize that given that Milwaukee has had several socialist mayors (Frank Zeidler, Emil Seidel, and Daniel Hoan).

  42. happyjack27 says:

    That doesn’t sound paranoid at all, Mr. McCarthy.

    Clearly, I’m the hyperbolic one who only sees in black and white.

  43. Steve G says:

    That would have been Senator McCarthy.
    🙂

    No exaggeration or hyperbole there, eh?

    Have a good day.

  44. happyjack27 says:

    Steve G. says: “happyjack says…”It’s a massive worldwide conspiracy, Steve G. All of media and all of the scientists and all of the teachers are teaming up to feed the rest of us lies.

    Fox News and Donald Trump are the only truly reliable sources of information.”

    I never said that…

    No, you said, and I quote “Agree that truth matters. Of course the MSM push little more than fake news, so one needs to take all of that with a grain of salt.”

  45. happyjack27 says:

    So I stand corrected – “Fox News” would probably be considered part of the MSM.

    Let me revise my paraphrasing:

    “Donald Trump [is] the only truly reliable sources of information.”

    …or are there “Alt. news” sites you follow that I’m not listing? Britebart maybe? Limbaugh? Glenn Beck?

    Gotta fill in some blanks for me, brotha….

  46. Steve G says:

    Sure as hell not Glenn Beck.
    He’s nutso!

    Frankly some of the best and most timely news I read online is The US version of the UK Daily Mail.

    I wouldn’t call them particularly alt. anything, but they do get onto stories quick and don’t seem to lean either way much at all.
    They also have a lot of fluff but since their story links are short you don’t have to wade through a lot of click bait to get to what you actually want to read.

    But I do think that for hard news they work in the tradition of the British Press and take no prisoners.
    And I appreciate that. Becasue I do think I have an open mind about most things.

    Plus they have the best breaking news photos I’ve ever seen.
    When the cat 5 tornado ripped through Joplin, MO 6 years ago, their pictorial coverage was the most comprehensive I could find. For many years, we drove through Joplin every year on our way ‘up Nort’ and spent the night there on our way back, so were interested in what was left before we headed through there that year.
    Not much unfortunately, which we saw for ourselves about a month or 2 after the disaster.

    Here’s a link to that story and pics.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1389737/Joplin-MO-tornado-At-89-dead-twister-cuts-4-mile-swathe-Missouri-town.html

  47. happyjack27 says:

    Okay, well i can’t particularly evaluate your claim of neutrality if you don’t actually link to any new stories discussing recent political events. And there certainly has been no shortage of those lately. I mean, take your pick… alternate facts, muslim bans, reporter bans, state department mass exodus…. these are all rather newsworthy events, and it’s pretty hard to put a slant on them – left or right – you can’t put lipstick on a pig, and throwing mud on one doesn’t really make it look any different.

  48. happyjack27 says:

    Personally I get my news from a variety of different sources and use critical thinking http://criticalthinkeracademy.com/ to evaluate everything i read (or hear).

    Diversity of sources provides redundancy, but that alone is not sufficient for error-checking. one still needs to use critical thinking. Especially in this day-and-age where information is ubiqutious and pervasive.

  49. Rich says:

    @SteveG–

    I have some perspective on that issue.
    I grew up quite poor in a blue collar family in Milwaukee (Riverwest). My dad was a tannery worker (Trostel). My mom never worked outside the home but took care of 6 kids.
    I remember the great industries in MKE: A.O.Smith, Globe Union (I worked there myself for a time), American Motors, Harnishfeger, Allis Chalmers, Bucyrus Erie, and more I’m sure. Most are gone now or acquired with much smaller operations in the city.

    Yes, it was different then and I’m glad you and your family “made it” (as inferred from your children’s college graduations).

    If you’d be so kind to continue your defense of Trump and all associated with him (Pudzer, Mnuchin, Tillerson, DeVos, et. al.), how exactly will any of what he’s and others are doing / are on track to do restore any semblance of what you recall — ostensibly that time when “America was great”? Interestingly, all the companies you mentioned were “great” for those who worked there because of their unions. Maybe tanning could come back after we abolish the EPA, but the Milwaukee River won’t be clean again (where do you think Trostel dumped its whatever?). Oh, except we’d only be paying the workers there $7.25/hr, so they’d be hard pressed to buy any of the products produced by those companies (or anything made with or from that down the supply chain), especially with only a sole breadwinner in the family.

    I can’t seem to line it up in my head how any of those billionaire cabinet appointments are going to have anyone else not like them on their radar or really care what happens to them. And, if maybe for a second, I were wrong and they did, the Republican-dominated legislature — currently operating in giddy mode over their “mandate” — sure as hell won’t.

    I have a lot more confidence I will benefit more from this president

    That’s great for you. Don’t forget about your neighbors, unless you also have a wall around your house! Isolationism and selfishness will only get us all so far…

    BTW, the opposite of that last statement does not equal a welfare state, regardless of what talk radio says.

  50. happyjack27 says:

    ^^

  51. Vincent Hanna says:

    Steve I notice you didn’t refute anything I said about Bannon and Breitbart. Rejecting a media outlet that proudly serves as a home for white supremacy does not mean one has a closed mind.

    Great post Rich.

  52. happyjack27 says:

    Misconceptions about open-mindedness:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

  53. Steve G says:

    Rich:
    I’ll call BS on at least Trostel when it comes to what you said….
    “Interestingly, all the companies you mentioned were “great” for those who worked there because of their unions”

    My dad worked there for 27 years.
    They went bankrupt and all he got was $1,200 severance.
    That’s it. one thousand, two hundred ~$45 for every year.
    No pension, nothing else.
    I wonder how the union heads fared? Couldn’t have been worse than my dad.

    He never made much money at Trostel. Take home pay in the 50’s and 60’s of like $75/week.

    Luckily, about 6 months later he landed at Badger State Tannery on N25th St. just South of I-94.
    They started him out as a salaried employee for like $10,000/year.
    He took over their leather splitting operation and tripled their production!
    They gave him a $1,000 bonus that first Christmas.
    He was flabbergasted that he was worth ‘that much’

    He just didn’t realize it for all those years.

  54. happyjack27 says:

    Okay so… all that begs the question: why would you support Trump?

    Misery loves company?

  55. happyjack27 says:

    He’s hawkishly anti-union (because america was so great before unions. long work hours, no safety – people losing limbs – child labor…)

    And he wants to eliminate the minimum wage and doesn’t want to at the same time. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/jul/28/donald-trump/donald-trump-gets-full-flop-stance-minimum-wage/ (because america was so great before wage laws)

    How can you possibly think that is going to benefit you, nonetheless be confident? On the second thing, you can’t even be confident of what he wants to do, nonetheless how it will affect you!

    The only way you can be confident, is if you’re one of the hyper-rich people bribing him. are you one of the Kochs? part of the Wal family? I find this incredibly improbable.

  56. happyjack27 says:

    He’s hawkishly anti-union (because america was so great before unions. long work hours, no safety – people losing limbs – child labor…)

    And he wants to eliminate the minimum wage and doesn’t want to at the same time. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/jul/28/donald-trump/donald-trump-gets-full-flop-stance-minimum-wage/ (because america was so great before wage laws)

    How can you possibly think that is going to benefit you, nonetheless be confident? On the second thing, you can’t even be confident of what he wants to do, nonetheless how it will affect you!

    The only way you can be confident, is if you’re one of the hyper-rich people bribing him. are you one of the Kochs? part of the Wal family? I find this incredibly improbable.

    This guy made his fortune by sociopathically exploiting people, with horrendously unethical business practices, and you think he’s going to HELP you? Are you insane?

  57. Steve G says:

    My guess is that Trump’s approach on just about any issue is that he takes a very strong position upfront and then negotiates from that point.
    That has proven to be very effective for him.

    So let’s agree to disagree for now in this maybe record setting thread out here at UM
    .
    Y’all have a nice day.

  58. Vincent Hanna says:

    Nah it’s not even close to record setting. The Harley noise story has like 200 comments.

    Your guess? Gee that’s comforting. How is that going to work against factors like globalization and automation and market forces? For example, he can promise to bring back coal jobs all he wants, but they aren’t coming back because of natural gas and market forces and automation. So then what?

  59. happyjack27 says:

    No, I will not agree to disagree about facts.

    The record shows that trumps approach to business is to be horrenduously unethical and sociopathic.

    Your “feelings” and “guesses” cannot change that. Nobody’s can.

    If you think a sociopath with horrenduously unethical business is going to help you out economically, then i’ve got a bridge to sell you.

  60. Vincent Hanna says:

    Trump’s fans are so impressed with his business acumen, but he was given millions by his daddy and has filed for bankruptcy four times.

    “Amid all the self-made myths about Donald Trump, none is more fantastic than Trump the moneymaker, the New York tycoon who has enjoyed a remarkably successful business career. In reality, Mr. Trump was a walking disaster as a businessman for much of his life. This is not just my opinion. Warren Buffett said as much this past week.”

    That is from a writer who covered him for the Wall Street Journal writer, not some liberal blog. https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/07/opinion/sunday/trump-the-bad-bad-businessman.html?_r=0

  61. Rich says:

    @SteveG, claims about figures from 47 to 67 years ago being “not much money” is applying current criteria to the past. Was $75 or $100 / week “much money” back in that era? I don’t know, I wasn’t alive, but let’s see if we can find out:

    This source (https://fraser.stlouisfed.org/files/docs/publications/employment/pages/1965-1969/16833_1965-1969.pdf) pegs average take-home-pay close to your $75 figure in 1956 and shows it rising over $100 by 1965. By contrast though, mining and construction paid better, according to the report. Also, the report also indicates that this rise in take home pay outstripped growth in prices, so people probably felt pretty comfortable.

    Trostel was out of business in 1969, so we can assume those wage figures went maybe a little higher, but not much.
    In comparison, your father’s jump over to Badger State was a good one: $10k grosses $192/wk.

    That they f*ed everyone on the way out (some obviously less than others), is no surprise. Workers are pretty much dead last in the line of “creditors”. Maybe Trostel wasn’t the best example out of the companies mentioned in this thread — it’s worth noting that there’s no longer a Badger State Tanning either — but they were all part of an era where there were solid middle class jobs that provided for families.

    Figuring out if Trump can “take us back there” requires a broad study of all the things that have changed.

    De-unionization was certainly one of those changes. I won’t pretend to defend everything every union everywhere has done, because there were certainly some shady things that had real consequences down the road — for example, among other factors, a union strike at the downtown Schlitz plant killed that whole operation.

    De-industrialization was another…So even if today’s companies are now “compelled” by Trump and or the administrations policies to return manufacturing to America, they’ll only need a tenth of the workforce they once did, those workers will also need advanced education to hold those jobs, and there will be no union to defend anything from the “ways of the company”. CEOs and execs will get all the spoils before any actual worker does.

    Hardly sounds like a recipe for widespread (middle class) success like we had when “America was Great”.

  62. happyjack27 says:

    We don’t have much of a middle class anymore. It’s been steadily shrinking since the mid 70’s. We’re mostly lower class and super-rich now.

    Check out the history of our Gini coefficient:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/01/Gini_since_WWII.svg/1024px-Gini_since_WWII.svg.png

    We’re about to pass up Mexico.

    Interestingly, that mid-70’s point where it started to rise corresponds with the start of the wage-productivity gap – when wages stopped following productivity. Coincidence? More like basic math.

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